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TwinNut · #16 Post by **TwinNut** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 1:49 pm

D-Rider wrote:TN - what's the object of your smoothness is everything quest? Is it a general refinement or is it mainly to address the on/off effect at small throttle openings?

It's this small throttle opening stuff that annoys me most. I've not done much about it yet (apart from a 15t sprocket) but would like to sort it out. I'm thinking that a PCIII may be a key item .... but it aint cheap .....

Assuming that this is what you've been working on, what's worked for you?

Just spent my youth on big Jap 4's (and much smoother twins) so I'm always looking to make the thing smoother, which i reckon should be, or at least mine should. It is more about the transition from off/on throttle. Even with gentlest twist it's not too nice so I've also bought a PCIII, which I've yet to fit, but hopefully should sort the problem. I don't want to remove the character but do want to make it a nicer beast to potter around on because at speed it's excellent. Said it before but I've ridden twins in the past which all had character but weren't as lumpy, such as KTM Super Duke (beautiful & awesome) and Suzuki TL and SV 1000's, both mega in their own way and both smoother.....handling was pretty numb on the Suzuki's though, the KTM was just alive

Things which have made a small difference was the usual 15T sprocket change, K&N filter, evo airbox mod, Blue Flame Evo's and top-spec fuel.......hopefully PCIII should do the biz.

HowardQ · #17 Post by **HowardQ** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 8:21 pm

Again as Gazuk would say .......... not a very helpful post

Probably from somebody who who knows sod all about real bikes (TN).
Obviously spent too much time on Jap IL4s

Interestin' comparison mate

loafersmate · #18 Post by **loafersmate** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 8:32 pm

throttle response from closed is fine so long as you have good throttle control

sabestian · #19 Post by **sabestian** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 8:43 pm

TwinNut wrote: Just spent my youth on big Jap 4's (and much smoother twins) so I'm always looking to make the thing smoother, which i reckon should be, or at least mine should. It is more about the transition from off/on throttle. Even with gentlest twist it's not too nice so I've also bought a PCIII, which I've yet to fit, but hopefully should sort the problem. I don't want to remove the character but do want to make it a nicer beast to potter around on because at speed it's excellent. Said it before but I've ridden twins in the past which all had character but weren't as lumpy, such as KTM Super Duke (beautiful & awesome) and Suzuki TL and SV 1000's, both mega in their own way and both smoother.....handling was pretty numb on the Suzuki's though, the KTM was just alive Things which have made a small difference was the usual 15T sprocket change, K&N filter, evo airbox mod, Blue Flame Evo's and top-spec fuel.......hopefully PCIII should do the biz.

I have the same feelings about off/on transition. It should be smoother IMO. That was one of the reasons that I bought PCIII recently. I'm trying the 3rd map now, trying to understand what it's doing to my bike

What I can say for sure is that PCIII makes the bike smoother. The on'off sensation is still there, especially under 3krpm (who uses those? Well, I do , and I'm proud of it

).

I think I'm still far from choosing the best map for my setup (Blueflames Evo

, derestricted). I will end up having the custom map prepared for me but now I'm rather broke.

Fausto · #20 Post by **Fausto** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 9:34 pm

I don't really understand this fuss about smooth transition / uptake.

Either some bikes are far worse than others (entirely possible)
OR some riders are less tolerant and/or less smooth with the throttle.

I will repeat my usual mantra here.... Keep on top of your bike's maintenance. With the throttle free play taken up and the chain well adjusted and lubed then the engine is no problem here - well mine isn't . No worse than my Bandit 12 anyway.

It is possible that I have subconsciously made adjustments to my riding style to compensate for a more "difficult" v twin engine but I don't think so. I think the trick to smooth riding is to be on the gas well before you need it. i.e. before corner entry so you can have the throttle balanced on the point of acceleration already and you are not looking for that point mid/late corner when any snatchiness feels most disconcerting.

At least that's what I think has happened on the few occasions I feel I really nailed the perfect corner

D-Rider · #21 Post by **D-Rider** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 9:55 pm

Fausto wrote:I don't really understand this fuss about smooth transition / uptake.

Either some bikes are far worse than others (entirely possible)
OR some riders are less tolerant and/or less smooth with the throttle.

I will repeat my usual mantra here.... Keep on top of your bike's maintenance. With the throttle free play taken up and the chain well adjusted and lubed then the engine is no problem here - well mine isn't . No worse than my Bandit 12 anyway.

It is possible that I have subconsciously made adjustments to my riding style to compensate for a more "difficult" v twin engine but I don't think so. I think the trick to smooth riding is to be on the gas well before you need it. i.e. before corner entry so you can have the throttle balanced on the point of acceleration already and you are not looking for that point mid/late corner when any snatchiness feels most disconcerting.

At least that's what I think has happened on the few occasions I feel I really nailed the perfect corner

Dunno about the others, but my complaint is not in corners where you can "nail it". In those corners it's no problem to be on the throttle driving through - it's the low speed, around town, tight corner (road junction) stuff - particularly when the conditions are slippy and you really need a very smooth response.
The only way I've found to smooth things as much as I want is to slip the clutch a bit - but I'd prefer that off/on transition to be smooth enough not to have to bother with that.
I think I do have pretty good throttle control but the off/on transition from closed throttle is too much of a jump even with well adjusted throttle cables, synched throttle bodies, well adjusted chain etc.

Mind you, I'm quite willing to accept that I may be more tolerant of this than some.

Fausto · #22 Post by **Fausto** » Sat Mar 10, 2007 10:10 pm

Yes , agreed it's all far easier on faster corners but I feel the same technique applies to tight slow tricky ones too. I regularly have a mini roundabout I have to ride 270 degrees round and after a few nervous what gear/slip clutch/vary revs attempts I now just grab 1st, get the revs up and 'ride' it round under power. The use of the back brake can be handy to prevent it all getting too hairy if necessary. It's just a looser u turn really. By the way I practice u turns at every opp. God knows why but I enjoy them.

Viking · #23 Post by **Viking** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 6:07 am

I know I'm coming in very late to this thread...

The sticker on the tank of my Falco says 'Use Petrol of RON 95 or higher'. Which down here is classed as 'Premium' (both 95 RON and 98 RON).

I haven't been brave enough to stick the standard 91 RON fuel into her. I'm assuming that doing that would be A Bad Thing.

Falco9 · #24 Post by **Falco9** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 5:19 pm

Viking wrote:I know I'm coming in very late to this thread...

The sticker on the tank of my Falco says 'Use Petrol of RON 95 or higher'. Which down here is classed as 'Premium' (both 95 RON and 98 RON).

I haven't been brave enough to stick the standard 91 RON fuel into her. I'm assuming that doing that would be A Bad Thing.

RON 95 is our lowest over here Viking. I'm having a run out tonight (good god it's 14 degrees here today!!) and will try some RON 98 (super unleaded) to see if I can tell any difference (again)

See me? I don't mind spending my hard earned cash on research for my fellow Falco owners

F9

Aladinsaneuk · #25 Post by **Aladinsaneuk** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 7:22 pm

I think the trick to getting the best out of both ther falco, and for that matter any V Twin is knowing your gears.

Friends I ride with, who are both younger than me, and used to just Jap 4's are amazed by the lack of brake lights when they follow me... I use my gear box a LOT more than them, and it is so bad i do wear through the tops of my left boot....

OK - i have ridden a lot of older bikes - triumphs etc, which had crap brakes so you learnt the hard way to use the engine gears etc while cornering, but - i think it makes it better :)

falcomunky · #26 Post by **falcomunky** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 8:21 pm

Dint av brakes wen I were a lad...

Ive recently tried Essos Sooper-Dooper-Deluxe-Ferrari-Fuel(tm) and noticed absolutely no difference whatsoever, (except a slightly bigger dent in me wallet)!
Ah well. Back to good ol chip-pan lard...

HisNibbs · #27 Post by **HisNibbs** » Wed Mar 14, 2007 9:14 pm

I would not expect the octane rating of the fuel to have much if any effect on the on/off throttle transition. PCIII yes. Or have I got cross threaded?

If I'm pushing on a bit, I occassionaly find that if I back off the throttle a little mid corner, as an instinctive response to some unforseen event, there is a big change. The throttle is undobtedly very sensetive to small imputs. I have no problem in any other area and find it quite capable of dealing with tight turns and traffic filtering, though I probably employ the clutch in those circumstances to smooth things a little.

Kenif · #28 Post by **Kenif** » Thu Mar 15, 2007 8:44 am

Mine's fine until I have to filter through 3-lane, nose-to-tail traffic for about 5 miles.

So, that'll be every morning then...

Slipping the clutch and keeping the revs up is great for occasional use but if you're in very bad traffic, in hot weather (try getting to Lake Annecy in the height of the tourist season) the bike will fry.

Think there IS a lot of variation on different (same make) bikes on how the injection works at very low revs, no matter how good throttle control is.
Mine, of course, is excellent

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