Gearshift problems, not finding gear.

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control_67 · #1 Post by **control_67** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 1:45 pm

Been out for a shakedown run today after fitting the Evo airbox, Gabro EPROM and Fuel cans. The bike ran faultlessly for much of the run, pulled well, sounded amazing through the Hindhead tunnel and handled beautifully now the Ohlins shock is in.

On the way home it started to not want to shift into gear, the lever would move but not meet any resistance and not slot into a gear, on downshifts it seems to help to shift up another gear first then down two and the reverse for upshifts, I've never had an issue like this before so have no idea what could be the cause. I have noticed that the clutch fluid has turned that nice shade of aprilia greeny black, and I'm sure that there is less fluid in the reservoir than before. I have popped off the clutch slave and it does look as if it has been leaking, there is the same fluid on the pushrod and everything is pretty gunked up with old chain lube. My decision to buy a scottoiler has been made already, just waiting for the new year and any possible sale offers. I might just do chain and sprockets at the same time and make sure that everything is nice and clean in there too.

Does this sound fatal or is it likely to be something that the gearshift rod could be adjusted to fix?

D-Rider · #2 Post by **D-Rider** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 2:01 pm

It sounds like the clutch slave cylinder is leaking.

Many of us have changed to aftermarket slave cylinders.
The Evo unit is probably the best engineered but is expensive - and maybe you need to buy from USA (I'm not sure)
Others that we've used are the German made MPL (I have one of them) and the Oberon.

I know that in the new year Motorpike will have one on the market too.

However you can just replace the seal in your standard clutch slave. I think the Aprilia price is about £12 - though we have found an alternative source:
https://www.ridersite.com/viewtopic.php?t=4982

Obviously make sure everything in the slave is clean and smooth so that your new seal doesn't fail quickly.

control_67 · #3 Post by **control_67** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 2:15 pm

I was planning on changing the seal, maybe a new slave in the new year. Would it be worth doing the jet mod at the same time?

Would the clutch slave cause the dodgy shifting? It felt like trying to shift to the imaginary 7th going from 2nd to 3rd until I shifted to first and went 1-2-3, if you see what I mean.

D-Rider · #4 Post by **D-Rider** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 2:28 pm

If the clutch slave has been leaking it won't be pushing the push-rod properly and the clutch will not release properly and will drag. This will make shifting difficult.

It's not the only cause of the symptoms you've described but it's the most usual thing to occur.

The clutch jet mod is cheap and therefore always worth doing. It won't help without having a properly working clutch though.

Aladinsaneuk · #5 Post by **Aladinsaneuk** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 2:32 pm

motopike version will not be available till april i believe

control_67 · #6 Post by **control_67** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 2:35 pm

Ok, so I'll start small and do the seal, get everything cleaned up and look at the clutch jet mod. The oberon cylinders don't look too badly priced, has anyone used them?

Falcopops · #7 Post by **Falcopops** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 2:40 pm

Long shot, but if you've had the pedal off, did you put it back on the same splines as it came off? 1 different makes a huge difference so I reckon you'd notice right off.

Also the linkages and pedal could be a bit gunked up that might stop the pedal returning to the default position properly, again unlikely, but worth looking for the simple solution before delving into the technical/expensive areas.

control_67 · #8 Post by **control_67** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:12 pm

I just popped the slave off for a clean and inspect. The seal actually looks ok, the oil on the pushrod looks more like engine oil. The seal on the slave is clean and intact, is red rubber grease ok to use on it? I will reassemble with new washers and bleed through some fresh fluid.

Does it sound like there's something more serious going on though?

D-Rider · #9 Post by **D-Rider** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 3:41 pm

The bit that had me going down the route of the slave seal was:

control_67 wrote:I have noticed that the clutch fluid has turned that nice shade of aprilia greeny black, and I'm sure that there is less fluid in the reservoir than before.

The colour issue doesn't matter the loss of fluid does. I guess if you top it up and make sure it's bled properly you can wait to see whether it really does go down.
If so, it's a matter of finding out where it's going. Usually the slave seal but the master cylinder has been known to leak and leaks from other joints in the system are possible.

szrdave · #10 Post by **szrdave** » Thu Dec 22, 2011 6:42 pm

Falcopops wrote: Also the linkages and pedal could be a bit gunked up that might stop the pedal returning to the default position properly, again unlikely, but worth looking for the simple solution before delving into the technical/expensive areas.

This would be my first check, especially if you've been commuting through winter.

The Falco is pretty happy to shift up (and down with a blip) without troubling the clutch, so a bit of dragging shouldn't have too much effect, plus you'd feel it when stationary in gear and would get a big 'clonk' when selecting first from neutral.

The linkage is re-buildable so half an hour to disassemble, clean, lube and rebuild has got to be worth it.

xrphil · #11 Post by **xrphil** » Wed Dec 28, 2011 9:06 pm

When the seal in my slave went it was sudden and the lever came right back to the bars. i would check the set up first - make sure chain tensions OK and that gear change isnt snagging on (aftermarket) exhausts- mine does this and I have to adjust it to a position to avoid this.
Other issues could be the selector mechanisim? but I have only done this on a CRM and that jambed in gear!
You should be able to change up OK without the clutch- if it wont do this I would look more toward the gear side than the clutch.
Phil

control_67 · #12 Post by **control_67** » Wed Dec 28, 2011 9:12 pm

The falco wouldn't start for a couple of days, no idea why but it fired up first thing this evening so I went for a little test ride. The gear change issue is still there but as I was wearing trainers I had a little more feel. Turns out the gear lever isn't quite returning to the middle position between changes. Is this going to be a linkage issue? I'm going to clean it all up but am I likely to have to adjust the rod length?

xrphil · #13 Post by **xrphil** » Thu Dec 29, 2011 8:45 am

You shouldn`t have to change the rod length at all- its there for small adjustments in the peddle hieght- just undo the two locknuts and twist it in either direction in the middle to adjust the gearchange peddle height.
While you are there use your hand to push the peddle up and down -as in a gear change (ENGINE OFF!!) and look to the back of this to see if it is snagging on your new exhaust? mine does this and I have to adjust it away from it.

D-Rider · #14 Post by **D-Rider** » Thu Dec 29, 2011 11:25 am

control_67 wrote:The falco wouldn't start for a couple of days, no idea why but it fired up first thing this evening so I went for a little test ride. The gear change issue is still there but as I was wearing trainers I had a little more feel. Turns out the gear lever isn't quite returning to the middle position between changes. Is this going to be a linkage issue? I'm going to clean it all up but am I likely to have to adjust the rod length?

Yes - this will make shifting difficult and fixing it is easy.
My advice would be not only to clean and re-grease the joints in the linkage but remove the rearset and also clean and re-grease the pivot on which the gear lever is mounted.
obviously when you remove the linkage, mark it and the splined shaft so that you get it back together as before it came apart.
You shouldn't need to adjust the rod length.

.... and when you've done that, I suggest popping over to the other side of the bike and doing the same to the rear brake linkage and brake pedal pivot ... if one side needs doing, it's a fair bet the other does too.

control_67 · #15 Post by **control_67** » Thu Dec 29, 2011 3:59 pm

Will do D-Rider. I did notice that the rear brake light switch wasn't cancelling as it should so I adjusted the locknut for that, I'll get the grease out this evening and give it all a good old lubing then.

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Gearshift problems, not finding gear.

Gearshift problems, not finding gear.

Re: Gearshift problems, not finding gear.