Sudden cut out, won’t turn over

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Noeli0 · #1 Post by **Noeli0** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 6:44 am

Hi Guys, got a bit of a problem,
I was coming off the motorway last night (deaccelerating) , when the bike suddenly cut out, pulled the clutch in and rolled to a lay-by, l went to start it and the clocks have reset (to km) and the bike doesn’t turn over, you here a click when the starter is pressed but thats it. My initial thought was a fuse, went through what I could while waiting for the recovery truck but no luck, the battery voltage was 11.4v, but that still should be enough to turn it over. I’m guessing something has tripped the bike out to reset the clocks like that, but it was all a bit out the blue. I need some help with this one, any suggestions?

Falcopops · #2 Post by **Falcopops** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 7:29 am

tip over sensor under the seat would be my 1st guess.

Lift the seat and look for something adrift with a rubber mounting band on it. Make sure its mounted the right way up and try.

When mine was left lolling about by a "mechanic" it would cause a cut out that needed a the key to be turned off and back on before it would restart.

anzacinexile · #3 Post by **anzacinexile** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 7:32 am

Sounds like you've lost battery volts.

Check terminals, 30amp fuses and if they're OK, suspect the battery itself.

A dash reset is caused by the voltage dropping below a certain value FYI

Best of luck..............

anzacinexile · #4 Post by **anzacinexile** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 7:33 am

Falcopops wrote:tip over sensor under the seat would be my 1st guess.

Lift the seat and look for something adrift with a rubber mounting band on it. Make sure its mounted the right way up and try.

When mine was left lolling about by a "mechanic" it would cause a cut out that needed a the key to be turned off and back on before it would restart.

Wouldn't think so - he would get a "NO START" on his dash if it was the sensor and it wouldn't cause dash reset

D-Rider · #5 Post by **D-Rider** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 8:52 am

Agree with anzac on the diagnosis ...though the "No Start" message does not seem to be triggered by the tip-over sensor but happens when you try to start the bike and after a while it doesn't start. Not all causes of it not starting give rise to the message and the tip sensor preventing it starting is one of them - however the tip sensor itself doesn't generate the message.

..... at least from my experiments ....

Noeli0 · #6 Post by **Noeli0** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 11:58 am

thanks guys,
checked 30amp fuses and battery conections, all ok I'm going to get a new battery tomorrow. I understand there must have been a power loss to reset the clocks, but the not starting has got me, tried all combination of things, clutch in, on/off repeatedly no luck, I dont rememer seeing the 'no start' would this be because the starter wasnt spinning?

flatlander · #7 Post by **flatlander** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 12:41 pm

Daft as it sounds you haven't hit the kilkswitch whilst fettling have you? Mine has cut out on the mway once or twice usually my error but a rolling restart fixed it thank goodness ( and yes I was low on fuel at the time ... Again lol)

Noeli0 · #8 Post by **Noeli0** » Thu Oct 06, 2011 6:43 pm

definatly not the kill switch, I wish it was that easy

willmoir · #9 Post by **willmoir** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 8:05 pm

similar thing on mine few wks ago got home went to start next day just a click tried new battery still the same got advice from here checked wiring etc new solenoid still just click shipped to bike mechanic thinking starter motor turns out to be failure of cam chain/tensioner mechanic recomends replacment engine
had no strange noise or anything to suggest this was going to happen just came home swiched off as usual
hope yours is not he same maybe try to turn engine maually to be sure

Falconihlist · #10 Post by **Falconihlist** » Fri Oct 07, 2011 8:43 pm

could it be inside the kill switch?

Falco9 · #11 Post by **Falco9** » Sat Oct 08, 2011 7:42 am

willmoir wrote:similar thing on mine few wks ago got home went to start next day just a click tried new battery still the same got advice from here checked wiring etc new solenoid still just click shipped to bike mechanic thinking starter motor turns out to be failure of cam chain/tensioner mechanic recomends replacment engine
had no strange noise or anything to suggest this was going to happen just came home swiched off as usual
hope yours is not he same maybe try to turn engine maually to be sure

Personally I'd get a second opinion unless your mechanic is a trusted friend or comes very very highly recommended. If the bike won't start how does he know its the camchain mechanism thats faulty??? Sounds a very dodgy conclusion to me based upon your description. The camchain mech is the last place you'd look if the bike wont even turn over and I've never heard of it resulting in an engine replacement. They do very occasionally stick / fail but they are quite an easy fix I'm told
This is just my personal opinion of course

F9

Falco9 · #12 Post by **Falco9** » Sat Oct 08, 2011 7:44 am

Noeli0 wrote:definatly not the kill switch, I wish it was that easy

I'd try disconnecting the side stand switch and give it a go, they do fail and cause the engine to cut out

F9

willmoir · #13 Post by **willmoir** » Sat Oct 08, 2011 8:31 am

mechanic is very good engine builder having built and raced many ducati superbikes amongst others
he removed starter and turn engine manually replacement engine more to do with economics

HowardQ · #14 Post by **HowardQ** » Sat Oct 08, 2011 11:26 am

Not sure what's being said here regards a new engine or tensioner etc..
Is he trying to say the valves have hit the pistons?
Get the bike on a workshop stand with the rear wheel off the ground. Take the plugs out, put in 2nd or 3rd gear and does the motor turn if you turn the back wheel?
If it will easily turn via the back wheel, turn it over very carefully this way, does it suddenly stop with a clunk, as it would if a valve had hit a piston?
Are there any funny noises?
Keep turning this way to make sure it feels smooth and nothing locks.
Will it now turn over on the starter with no compression?
Again are there any funny noises?
If now spinning totally free, there is nothing much wrong with the engine or timing chain/tensioner, other than some excess free play, but you would have probably heard a flapping chain for some months before now if that was the case.

I would try this before just accepting some sort of seized engine needing replacement, the Rotax engines are pretty bullet proof.

Noeli0 · #15 Post by **Noeli0** » Sat Oct 08, 2011 5:25 pm

Finally got time this afternoon to have a look, put new battery in still didn’t turn over, so removed a spark plug in each cylinder and tried to move I manually, couldn’t move it.

I had just changed the oil/filter about 50miles ago so I hope it hasn’t had an issue and seized- doesn't look good though.
Not sure what to try next, I might remove the starter tomorrow and see if it spins.