Non starter

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mellow yellow · #1 Post by **mellow yellow** » Tue May 22, 2007 2:58 pm

Having gone through the Forum search I reckoned that the reason my bike wasn't starting was down to the starter/solenoid. (I did check all fuses first

)

I duly ordered the identical yamaha part and popped it on today and ......... click click click click click STILL WONT BURST INTO LIFE

Actually the click is more like rapid machine gun fire but you get the drift. The sound is definately coming from the solenoid so its trying its best.

Battery was measured with a meter and producing 13V at the time I tried to start it.

So anyone out there got any ideas? I'm at a loss

Falcoholic · #2 Post by **Falcoholic** » Tue May 22, 2007 3:52 pm

Take the solenoid out. Strip it, clean it and put it back in it's not a big job.

Seein as you're North of the Border where are ya I might be able to lend a hand.

falcomunky · #3 Post by **falcomunky** » Tue May 22, 2007 3:52 pm

HT leads? Coils? Plugs?

Check all of the aboves general condition.
The HTs may be breaking down internally, (lotta heat off the engine as well as from the current they carry!); Way to check is to fit another working set.
Same fer the coils n plugs.
You could also pull one plug at a time, leave it connected to the HT then earth it against summink on the bike and try to fire her up. Apart from the extra noise with the plug out, you should see a nice bright spark at each plug end, (assuming your earthing it properly).
You should also check what colour/condition the plug ends are in as well.
I assume you have fuel? The filter aint blocked is it? It IS unleaded petrol in the tank???

Erm, erm, ah; You got an alarm/immobiliser? Could be playin up maybe?

mellow yellow · #4 Post by **mellow yellow** » Tue May 22, 2007 4:38 pm

Take the solenoid out. Strip it, clean it and put it back in it's not a big job.

Would I need to do this as its a brand new unit?

Seein as you're North of the Border where are ya I might be able to lend a hand.

Ayrshire - 20 miles south of Glasgow

I assume you have fuel? The filter aint blocked is it? It IS unleaded petrol in the tank???
Erm, erm, ah; You got an alarm/immobiliser? Could be playin up maybe?

Yep, proper fuel in the tank. ITs not even getting to the turning over stage. I just thumb the starter and all I get is the solenoid clicking away merrily.

I do have an alarm/immobiliser. Unfortunately it was on the bike when I got it. Not mad keen on them as all they do is drain batteries

If it was that though I wouldn't expect anything to happen i.e just like having the kill switch in

D-Rider · #5 Post by **D-Rider** » Tue May 22, 2007 5:23 pm

Starter Motor ???

Thumper · #6 Post by **Thumper** » Tue May 22, 2007 10:59 pm

Well if the battery is good and the relay and solenoid is good check the battery leads, are they clean and tight? If all this checks out it does look as if it's the starter motor but boy these things are so reliable.

Try some WD40 in the ignition switch and starter button also

mellow yellow · #7 Post by **mellow yellow** » Tue May 22, 2007 11:34 pm

Just spent a couple of hours in the garage and still no joy

Using the Manual I've checked resistance at the regulator/rectifier and coils and they all check out ok (well as ok as I can tell as my meter isn't the best tool in the toolbox so to speak)

Sparkplugs were a wee bit discoloured but not enough to stop the bike from firing up I would have thought.

Obviously the message is getting from the start button to the solenoid ok hence the buzzing/clicking but not much after that. My hunch is either

a) not enough juice from the battery to fire her up or
b) starter motor or
c) f**k knows?!!

Falcoholic · #8 Post by **Falcoholic** » Wed May 23, 2007 9:07 am

Im in Ayrshire too. Galston to be precise.

I'll PM ya ma moby number and we'll get together for a fixing session

Falcopops · #9 Post by **Falcopops** » Wed May 23, 2007 12:45 pm

Sounds a bit strange, clearly juice is getting to the solenoid to make it click and engage the starter circuit, but something is causing it to disconnect then reconnect, that's the rapid clicking noise.

Try shorting the big wires on the bottom of the solenoid, if the bike starts then the solenoid is the likely culprit. Use an old piece of metal, there are likely to be sparks and melting involved.

As far as I know the solenoid should continue to connect the starter current as long as the starter is pressed (the sprag clutch allows the engine to disengage from the starter motor when it fires up). I wasn't aware of any circuitry that disengaged the solenoid on startup.

As a long shot you should check the main earth points are clean and tight, but sounds like a dodgy solenoid to me.

Falcoholic · #10 Post by **Falcoholic** » Wed May 23, 2007 1:41 pm

Gonna go over and check it out later. He only stays about 5 miles from me so there is always the option of a quick swap with the suspect parts to try and work out what the problem is.

D-Rider · #11 Post by **D-Rider** » Wed May 23, 2007 2:46 pm

Falcopops wrote:
As far as I know the solenoid should continue to connect the starter current as long as the starter is pressed (the sprag clutch allows the engine to disengage from the starter motor when it fires up). I wasn't aware of any circuitry that disengaged the solenoid on startup.

Was wondering if a faulty starter motor winding (shorted) may be dragging the voltage down to the point that the solenoid is dropping out. As soon as it drops out, voltage rises again, solenoid re-engages, voltage drops, it drops out again etc.
Click,click click click .......

But as you say Dale, checking the connections and condition of the wiring is good advice.

mellow yellow · #12 Post by **mellow yellow** » Wed May 23, 2007 4:02 pm

Had another go at it this afternoon and.......... as Toyah once sang - 'It's a mystery'

Managed to get it going by using jump leads off the car and after a few go's it started so left it running a wee while, switched off, thumbed the starter and yes you guessed it ......click,click.click.

Took a reading with the meter while it was running and it was showing 14V which would suggest the regulator is doing its job.

So check the earthing point I thought. It looked fine but gave it a clean up anyway but still no joy.

Falcoholic is coming round later so maybe between us we'll get to the bottom of the problem.

This could be a test case

Falken · #13 Post by **Falken** » Wed May 23, 2007 6:14 pm

If it starts from the jump leads it must be the battery.

HowardQ · #14 Post by **HowardQ** » Wed May 23, 2007 6:35 pm

I'd still bet it's the battery leads. If it starts with jump leads the starter and solenoid are OK. If the battery voltage is fine that is obviously OK.
When you put jump leads on you almost always clamp them part on the battery terminal and part on the lead, so the extra battery can go straight through the leads, and start the bike.
Mine died out on a run a couple of months ago. Got similar clicking noises.
Checked everything best I could on the road, usual favourites, side stand switch, red cut out switch etc..
Looked at battery leads, pulled at em and everything looked tight and OK.
Couldn't find anything else so took em both off, did all the clever things like lookin at em! Hoping to see something stupid.
Looked OK as usual, so put em back on tightened em up.
Hey presto - started instantly!
Give it another try, nothing to lose.

mellow yellow · #15 Post by **mellow yellow** » Wed May 23, 2007 10:30 pm

Well Falcoholic and i had a look at it this evening and we're now suspecting the alarm may be drawing a high load somehow which is reducing the current getting to the solenoid which is preventing starting.

The shorting the solenoid trick with a screwdriver didn't work too well. There were sparks and a very laboured starter motor trying to kick into life but alas not enough oomph.

Trouble is. if it is the alarm then thats going to be a right PITA to try and sort out