Cold starting

Message

stumblebum76 · #1 Post by **stumblebum76** » Tue Nov 26, 2013 4:23 pm

Went out on the bike today for a blast after eventually getting it started! Is there a certain method to starting these bikes from cold? Or do I have to perform some kind of pagan dance to awaken the beast? I used full choke to start with to no avail then after much huffing and puffing I pinned the throttle and it eventually started, what methods do you chaps use? Any info is gratefully received.

Many thanks
Jay/Jimmer/stumblebum!

D-Rider · #2 Post by **D-Rider** » Tue Nov 26, 2013 4:44 pm

OK

Firstly it's NOT a choke, it's just a fast-idle control.

The method for cold starting is detailed in the user manual.

Basically, fully deploy the fast-idle lever
Do NOT touch the throttle (you risk flooding it if you give it any throttle)
Press the starter until it starts.
Obviously if it doesn't start after a few seconds it's a good idea to stop pressing it!

Once started, gradually close the fast-idle as the bike warms up (I tend to let it idle at about 2,000 rpm until the temperature rises to about 44 C and close it after that - other people have their own "rules")

This method of starting is pretty reliable - if it doesn't work well for you, check your plugs are clean and gapped and your air filter is clean (and other similar maintenance tasks)

If you do happen to flood it, the "Emergency" method that usually works is to hold the throttle wide open and thumb the button until it clears its head - almost always does the trick (but try to avoid it)

Tonyunn · #3 Post by **Tonyunn** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 8:47 am

As above but in my case I do this and my bike has started every time when cold.

Fast idle full
Pull in clutch
Start
Knock the fast idle back half straight away
Ride until 45-50 degrees and then knock off fast idle
Try and ride until bike at full temp and watch your idle speed if below 76 or what ever is your normal temp.

Apart from horror stories about sprags and batteries these bike are robust and usually behave themselves.

Falco668 · #4 Post by **Falco668** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 10:50 am

+1, DO NOT touch the throttle when attempting a start, should have no probs each and every start. Enjoy!

blinkey501 · #5 Post by **blinkey501** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 2:20 pm

+1. Prolong starting can also cause sprag problems.
But i like doing sprag clutches

For a fee of course

D-Rider · #6 Post by **D-Rider** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 2:40 pm

Not so much the length of the starting process that causes the problems per se but starting with a weak battery causing the sprag not to engage well.

Repeated and lengthy starts will drain the battery and can lead to the conditions that cause sprag problems.

But don't worry too much about all this talk of sprag problems - in reality, few people have had them.

Tonyunn · #7 Post by **Tonyunn** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 3:53 pm

One thing no one's mentioned, if you have a 50 amp starter solenoid ditch it in favour of a 150 amp one, someone explained to me it's all about the contacts inside and not what the rating is, the 150 ones work better.
They cast about £15 which in Falco terms is a pittance.

stumblebum76 · #8 Post by **stumblebum76** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 4:16 pm

It just wasn't having it on fast idle, I shall try again the next time I go out. I do have a receipt for a 100amp starter relay, is that stock or an upgrade?

D-Rider · #9 Post by **D-Rider** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 5:06 pm

stumblebum76 wrote:It just wasn't having it on fast idle, I shall try again the next time I go out. I do have a receipt for a 100amp starter relay, is that stock or an upgrade?

If I remember they originally fitted a 50A and then later on a 100A

It's not so much the current carrying capacity of the relay that's the problem - they are just a bit of a crap relay and the terminals tend to oxidise (though 50A is a bit marginal)

If your starter motor was turning the engine over OK then don't expect this to make any improvement to firing up.

I'd check plugs (clean, gap, whether properly tightened into the head) and air filter (whether clean (this can cause starting difficulty when very dirty - I know from experience).

Oh, also I assume your fuel is not old too.

Could be other things to look at but that's where I'd start.

blinkey501 · #10 Post by **blinkey501** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 7:27 pm

stumblebum76 wrote:It just wasn't having it on fast idle, I shall try again the next time I go out. I do have a receipt for a 100amp starter relay, is that stock or an upgrade?

Mmmm. Tell me more about your bike. Does it smell rich on tick over?

stumblebum76 · #11 Post by **stumblebum76** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 8:02 pm

blinkey501 wrote:
stumblebum76 wrote:It just wasn't having it on fast idle, I shall try again the next time I go out. I do have a receipt for a 100amp starter relay, is that stock or an upgrade?

Mmmm. Tell me more about your bike. Does it smell rich on tick over?

It did smell a bit rich when I was sat waiting at the lights a few times. As for the spark plugs, I don't think they've been changed since the last main service back in 2009. Should I replace them with the standard DCP9RE plugs or is there something better I can use? Come to think of it I don't think the air filter's been changed either!

blinkey501 · #12 Post by **blinkey501** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 8:19 pm

I wondering if the bike has had an aftermarket chip. A chip that is not compatable to your set up can cause the problems you describe.

blinkey501 · #13 Post by **blinkey501** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 8:22 pm

stumblebum76 wrote:
blinkey501 wrote:
stumblebum76 wrote:It just wasn't having it on fast idle, I shall try again the next time I go out. I do have a receipt for a 100amp starter relay, is that stock or an upgrade?

Mmmm. Tell me more about your bike. Does it smell rich on tick over?
It did smell a bit rich when I was sat waiting at the lights a few times. As for the spark plugs, I don't think they've been changed since the last main service back in 2009. Should I replace them with the standard DCP9RE plugs or is there something better I can use? Come to think of it I don't think the air filter's been changed either!

Standard plugs are fine. Some have said they have noticed improvement with the iridium plugs.
I would be tempted to fit a K@N air filter as it can be used after cleaning and oiling.
Btw I have ordered spark plugs and oil from opie oils and received a club discount which made the deal quite attractive.

D-Rider · #14 Post by **D-Rider** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 8:44 pm

If you can run to it, go for the Iridiums - they can improve things especially for starting and marginal situations.
The DENSO ones have a finer electrode than the NGKs which gives a greater charge density.

I should declare an interest as I work for DENSO but am nothing to do with the sparkplug side of the business (and, no, I can't get discount - not even for myself)

Dirty air filter would make it run rich (so if it is running a bit rich it could be just as likely that is the cause as a chip that doesn't suit)

stumblebum76 · #15 Post by **stumblebum76** » Wed Nov 27, 2013 9:05 pm

D-Rider wrote:If you can run to it, go for the Iridiums - they can improve things especially for starting and marginal situations.
The DENSO ones have a finer electrode than the NGKs which gives a greater charge density.

I should declare an interest as I work for DENSO but am nothing to do with the sparkplug side of the business (and, no, I can't get discount - not even for myself)

Dirty air filter would make it run rich (so if it is running a bit rich it could be just as likely that is the cause as a chip that doesn't suit)

Well I don't seem to be able to find the standard ones, what are the DENSO (iridium) equivalents please?