Electrical numpty needs advice for MOT

Message

FalcoDaz · #1 Post by **FalcoDaz** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 8:57 am

Hi you guys, first off let me state I do not "do" electrics! I didn't pay attention in Physics when i was at school and have never caught up since.

So I am requesting a little assistance to avoid an MOT failure next week. I replaced my mirrors with a set of second generation Mille ones that have the integral indicators. I was chuffed with the mod, but now the indicators don't flash unless I have the side-light on or the whole bike has been run for a while and the everything is comprehensively 'warm'.

I'm thinking that it's a resistance issue and needs some kind of nominal resistor somewhere in the loom. This is the bit that freaks me, chopping and cutting into stuff.

Has anyone got a simple, none to complex solution that I might be able to understand and undertake with little invasive surgery?

D-Rider · #2 Post by **D-Rider** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 9:09 am

Aren't the 2nd Gen Mille ones just normal filament bulbs?

My first step would be to check all the connectors are clean and making good connection.

FalcoDaz · #3 Post by **FalcoDaz** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:02 am

Hi D-Rider,

Yes they're not LEDs or anything trick. I'll check the connections, but I'm confident they're sound because the indicators work perfectly well... as long as I have my headlight on! Which I always do, but that's apparently not good enough for the MOT.

I'm wondering if the wire I used to connect them us is finer and therefore lower resistance than the originals, but my knowledge of electrical systems can't explain why they would fail to work without further load on the loom?

I'm thinking another bulb in-line (something i could manage, but would prefer not to) might work or different wattage bulbs, what do you think?

Dalemac · #4 Post by **Dalemac** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:11 am

Have you removed, cleaned, and tested the switchgear?

They headlights and indicators are on separate circuits (obviously). Sounds to me like something might have come loose in the switchgear or something.

D-Rider · #5 Post by **D-Rider** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:22 am

Finer wire would give higher resistance but very unlikely to be the issue. You certainly don't want to go sticking resistors in.
Without seeing how you have connected them it's hard to diagnose the problem - let alone understand what might have been done to allow them to work with the headlight on.

I presume the standard front indicators have been removed, the new ones plugged in to where the standard ones connected and the rear ones are standard?

spiderwheels · #6 Post by **spiderwheels** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 11:55 am

Easy fix: Get a late model switch gear without a headlight switch.

Have you tried putting the original indicators back on to see if the problem goes away? It's unlikely but that would be a quick way to rule out having to laboriously diagnose the indicator circuit.

wayno · #7 Post by **wayno** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 1:39 pm

I agree with spiderwheels, if the problem persists then it's something to do with the switchgear.

I'm not sure what wattage bulbs they use in the newer ones, but the original bulbs are the daft 10w ones, not the run of the mill 23w ones everyone else uses (maybe they switched to the higher wattage on later models)

FalcoDaz · #8 Post by **FalcoDaz** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 2:56 pm

Cheers all.

D-Rider you're correct with your presumption, I just replaced the original indicators with the new ones, plugging them in to exactly the same connectors. Even bought the same coloured wires to make it is straightforward as possible.

spiderwheels and wayno, I do still have the original indicators, so I'll give them a try and see what result I get. (this isn't a mod I've recently done, it's just that I changed MOT centre and they pointed it out, previous guy must've worked around it without letting me know)

Thanks for the being my brain.

fatboy · #9 Post by **fatboy** » Mon Nov 09, 2015 6:38 pm

Are you sure that your flasher unit can cope within additional two bulbs ?
They are of a pre determined lload rating and may not work properly if that load is exceeded.
Eg, if you start towing a trailer with your car you may need to upgrade the flasher unit because of the extra 2 or 4 blinker bulbs

FalcoDaz · #10 Post by **FalcoDaz** » Tue Nov 10, 2015 8:07 am

Update: Couldn't get the problem to recur!

Always difficult to resolve an intermittent problem. Went into the garage last night to test the original indicators but the problem wouldn't occur. Seems like it's going to be a lottery on MOT day.

I'm sure there is a fault somewhere, but I might just have to wait for it to get worse before being able to identify it.

fatboy, there aren't additional bulbs, just swapped ones, so shouldn't be the issue.

Thanks again all for your insights. I may be forced to return to this post sometime in the future

D-Rider · #11 Post by **D-Rider** » Tue Nov 10, 2015 9:24 am

Is it something to do with the way your lights are flashing in your Avatar?

I think there is every chance you've got a bit of wiring that needs repairing and sometimes it makes a circuit and sometimes it doesn't.

FalcoDaz · #12 Post by **FalcoDaz** » Tue Nov 10, 2015 7:11 pm

You're right D-Rider, good job the avatar hasn't got sound because the horn beeps in sync too!

But I think you're probably right about the dodgy connection somewhere... and I refer you to the title of this post and my opening sentence. It really does my swede!

D-Rider wrote:Is it something to do with the way your lights are flashing in your Avatar?

I think there is every chance you've got a bit of wiring that needs repairing and sometimes it makes a circuit and sometimes it doesn't.

Dalemac · #13 Post by **Dalemac** » Tue Nov 10, 2015 8:50 pm

I still think you should open up the switchgear and make sure everything is honkey dorey in there.

FalcoDaz · #14 Post by **FalcoDaz** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 7:49 pm

Having taken on all the good advice, at the weekend I decided to have a go at lubricating any and all (accessible) electrical connections. Started around the battery (dropped the spare 30Amp fuse down in the bowels somewhere), removed the rear cowl (eventually, there has to be an easier way?) snapped the bulb of my alarm indicator, got generally frustrated by my incompetence so put it all back together and gave up. No way was I going to try and take off the front bodywork.

During the whole shennanagins there were a couple of occasions where the battery connection broke, the alarm triggered and the dash reset itself, however all seemed fine when I left the garage. I'd reset the speedo to mph and the indicators stubbornly refused to fail.

Riding to the MOT today I noticed the speedo and trip both happily displaying zero... as I drove 4 miles at 30mph (I assumed). Anybody got any idea what I've done? Where does the speedo sensor live and do any of its connections live on the back half of the bike?

Dalemac · #15 Post by **Dalemac** » Tue Nov 17, 2015 8:36 pm

The speedo sensor is mounted near the rear brake caliper, and it goes off the speed of rotation of the rear disk bolts. Haven't changed them, have you?

They can go, and quite often, unfortunately.

There is a knack to removing the rear fairing, but it's hard to describe. The front bodywork is much simpler to remove.